[arie1985]

Please see resolution here: http://forum.abestweb.com/showpost.php?p=686503&postcount=16

Okay, I wrote this post, Sal did me a favor and replied me in AIM, now he keeps ignoring me as always so that's it, I don't care what he does with my revenue for March anymore, as he probably doesn't try to get it

I have worked with MarketLeverage for a long time, I didn't make much revenue with them but on Feb I started to run a Free Trial - so far so good

Usually I bug my AM all the time on the 15th just to make sure I'm getting paid for this month but for Feb (=>March 15) I didn't bug her, didn't tell her anything - I just got paid for February - and so far so good

So I did a nice revenue for March, really nice revenue, and in the end of March I found out that I can't login to my MarketLeverage account!

There was no email, no notice from anyone, just got suspended!!

So I tried to contact my AIM and she referred me to Sal and told me I no longer work with her, I have to work in front of Sal now - and wow, who could believe it - Sal finally told me to call him, and told me the advertiser doesn't want to pay them not only for March's revenue but also for February's revenue!!

I talked to him some more and tried to realize what exactly happened, eventually after I had to bug him so much I get a report in email with names of people they claim they took the Free Trial

25% of those people in this Excel file mention they didn't come from my referral link but he said they were!

More than that, 2 of my members, who have sent me a Driving License and College ID just to prove identity in my website - I found them on that list!!! I mean OMG wtf is this?? The advertiser is blaming them for committing fraud?? Maybe this advertiser is the one to be doing fraud

I did a research and so found out - this advertiser is really bad one, you just google its name and see how people scream it's a SCAM - I don't understand why MarketLeverage worked with this advertiser, but nevertheless - how the hell they blame for providing 100% bad leads???

Sal even warned me at first place that they would use attorneys to get the money they sent me for February back (a part of it) because they didn't get paid from the advertiser for Feb - Well, Sal, let me tell you something, I don't mind to bring you back the money without all this - but I want proofs!!! You didn't send me any proofs - this advertiser is blaming my traffic with nonsense!! Those same members took other free trials which I'm running with other networks and I've never gotten a complaint like this I got from this advertiser through MarketLeverage!! Never!!

I'm trying all the time to contact Sal but he doesn't reply, he has better things to do than focus on his affiliates - and I wonder my AM couldn't even stand by my side or try to help me resolve this issue - she just said I need to work with Sal on it

I posted a post of this kind at first place, but I edited it since Sal replied finally to me at AIM, but now he still ignores me, I can't even switch 2 words with this guy, I tried to call but no one picks up the phone

I'm really pissed with all this, they ran a scam advertiser and now I'm the one to be blamed, I'm the one to be ignored, and all I hear now is that they haven't gotten a respond from the advertiser - oh well, how long it takes to call them by phone? I can call this company right now and speak to a supervisor or any other person whatsoever - why can't they do it??

I'm really pissed with MarketLeverage, I got booted for no fair reason, and I lost money as well - I don't even mind to pay back Feb's "bad" revenue but I want to see a straight proof how come those people in the list are "bad" leads

This report they sent me looks like it made up or something, but nevertheless I can't understand why I can't talk to someone in MarketLeverage

All I want is to talk to someone, to get updates, but I'm getting nothing

This is totally a network I would suggest to other affiliates not to mess-up with because if you get complaints from advertisers - you won't get paid and no one will take care of you even if you're right

Sal, I wanna know why 2 people are in this list if I have their proof of identities, and I wanna know why you keep ignoring me all the time!!

It's so amazing, He's now online at AIM but just doesn't answer me

I don't care what you do next - you proved me that your network sucks and I'm really pissed with the way you threated me

This post this time won't be edited again, even if you reply me now

Arie

Please see resolution here: http://forum.abestweb.com/showpost.php?p=686503&postcount=16

[MichaelColey]

Is this through your incentive site? Does the advertiser allow incentives for this offer?

[arie1985]

Is this through your incentive site? Does the advertiser allow incentives for this offer?

Yes & Yes

And I must say this hasn't started today - it's being carried on from the end of March (like 6 days before the end of the month)

and I can't believe it - wow, it's so unbelievable, one member who sent me his Driving license, and took this offer - is on that list, omg, they're so idiots

I just can't believe it, I wonder what if all the member would send me their IDs, it's so unbelievable

[MichaelColey]

Incentive sites often produce really low-quality transactions. The consumers often aren't interested in anything but getting their incentive, so most just cancel and they're absolutely no value to the advertiser.

On one hand, it serves the advertiser right for dealing with incentive sites. On the other hand, many advertisers get burned by not knowing about the quality issues.

[arie1985]

Incentive sites often produce really low-quality transactions. The consumers often aren't interested in anything but getting their incentive, so most just cancel and they're absolutely no value to the advertiser.

On one hand, it serves the advertiser right for dealing with incentive sites. On the other hand, many advertisers get burned by not knowing about the quality issues.

First of all

Quality isn't fraud

Advertisers need to pay for low quality, but not for fraud - if they get low quality they ask to stop their campaign or the specific publisher from running the campaign

But anyway

Michael, this issue anyway isn't about quality!

They blame me for providing 100% "fraud" leads - wtf?!?!

They're fraud, not me

They have names of people in this excel file, and you see their location and their IP - everything is matched!

And as I said 25% transactions there didn't even come from my own website, but Sal says they were (they just for some reason don't have my affiliate ID on them)

I know what fraud is, and I know incentives always deal with fraud, but I've never gotten a complaint like this, and they don't do anything to change the situation or at least explain me what's going on - all I hear is just they haven't gotten any news from the advertiser - and I need to "beg" Sal to get those news as well, he just never replies otherwise!!!!!!

[adFinityJoe]

This is unfortunate situation. I understand both sides of the situation but arie at least deserves to be answered and not ignored. If I ever ignored my publishers on our network that would go against everything we believe in as far as customer service etc. I have nothing bad to say about Market Leverage as there are many nice people over there. But aire does deserve open communication to know what’s going on in my opinion. I hope the best works out for all parties.

[MichaelColey]

First of all

Quality isn't fraudGood point. I didn't mean to imply that at all. From the little I know about you, I would be very skeptical of any claims of fraud.

[chetf]

Arie, how many times has this happened to you now? I had to check the date of your post, because this isn't the first time right?

[webworker]

Chet, sure Arie's had this type of thing happen before, but: if you keep walking through the same cow pastures, you keep stepping into cowpies. It's part of the "landscape."

[arie1985]

Arie, how many times has this happened to you now? I had to check the date of your post, because this isn't the first time right?

Go jump off a cliff...

[arie1985]

Chet, sure Arie's had this type of thing happen before, but: if you keep walking through the same cow pastures, you keep stepping into cowpies. It's part of the "landscape."

I had some issues before but never like this - all the issues I had before could be resolved easily - this issue is a bigger one I guess, and I can live fine without it, I just said I opened this thread to talk about ignorance

And of course - the kind of advertiser I'm dealing here with is such a bad one - he didn't even look at the reports - people with real American IPs from real ISPs (such as cox, roadrunner, at&t) - how come he claims those people did fraud? I did see some fraud in the report but taking those few leads and making a general statement is really something I can't understand

[nakedgamer]

I have found, some time ago, that these types of offers are from questionable companies themselves. If you are half-way successful then they quickly question your "quality" of leads to give themselves an excuse NOT to have to pay for the leads. They can do it over and over again to new publisher because the network allows them to do so. The Network is more concerned about the advertiser than the publisher themselves.

Many times the Network eventually realizes this advertiser is a fraud themselves (or a cookie stuffer, malware provider, adware whore, etc) and eventually drops them only to pick up another one just like them. Then again I have questioned that some of the networks themselves are actually behind the offers.

Needless to say it's already a hard business to deal with reversals, but in these offers it's very high if you do any amount of business at all.

Eventually you will have the same problem with other networks.

Arie I would tell you now they are not going to answer you. The MOMENT a business mentions "lawyer" or "attorney" they shut up (if they are smart) and well they should. Any further e-mails would be more documetation for any possible lawsuit (I doubt it will actually happen as they don't want to expose themselves as scammers as well).

So move on to other offers and networks...

[webworker]

Arie, check Joe Lilly out, he's a regular here and is a communicator (and well liked, too). And now, see this latest announcement:

Partner Weekly Hooks up with Affiliate Fair Play (http://forum.abestweb.com/showthread.php?t=78724)

That says a lot.

[Eric Ewe]

i think the network and advertiser could handle this better. Any lead based or incentive programs will have fraud.

From my experience, I have seen fraudelent transactions from even our largest affiliates but it is the people on his/her site that is doing it. I would reverse out the transaction and let that person know about the issue. Sometimes, it is beyond the control of the affiliate.

I hate to say that it's the nature of the vertical but what the advertiser or network can do is to have a better mouse trap (tools) to prevent this from happening.

Definately like to know how the network and advertiser resolve this issue.

[arie1985]

Arie, check Joe Lilly out, he's a regular here and is a communicator (and well liked, too). And now, see this latest announcement:

Partner Weekly Hooks up with Affiliate Fair Play (http://forum.abestweb.com/showthread.php?t=78724)

That says a lot.

Thanks, I will check it

[SalG-ML]

Good day all,

Thank you for openly sharing your opinions. In a nutshell, Market Leverage is known for its candid, honest and 'NO BS' approach. We take that very seriously in all dealings - within our company, with our advertisers AND with our publishers. It's not just a catch-phrase! To that point, we have not edited any of these postings and have left them as they are.

In addition to our candor, Market Leverage is also known for paying our publishers reliably. This has always been the case, EVEN WHEN WE HAVE NOT BEEN PAID, from advertisers from time to time. While many of our publishers do not know it, over the years Market Leverage has paid significant commissions to publishers without receiving any payment from advertisers. The ONLY instance where payment to a publisher has not been made by us is when overtly fraudulent traffic is suspected. Obviously, we cannot just facilitate and be a party to such traffic streams. Just as we have gone out of our way to pay publishers to protect them from bad advertisers, we have to protect advertisers from fraudulent traffic.

As much as I would like to, I cannot answer in detail the claims made by Arie. There are legal issues related to the traffic, which we are working to resolve. I will say, however, that with the exception of a couple of days, when I was in the middle of many things, Arie has been updated with the simple fact that I have had 'no news' to pass on. Furthermore, to date, this issue appears to be related to bad traffic, NOT LOW QUALITY traffic. We understand the difference, and have always insisted that advertisers recognize it too.
As always, if anyone has any questions about anything pertaining to Market Leverage, please feel free to call me directly at 407 805-8884 or AIM me at salvatoreatppm. THANKS!

[arie1985]

Good day all,

Thank you for openly sharing your opinions. In a nutshell, Market Leverage is known for its candid, honest and 'NO BS' approach. We take that very seriously in all dealings - within our company, with our advertisers AND with our publishers. It's not just a catch-phrase! To that point, we have not edited any of these postings and have left them as they are.

In addition to our candor, Market Leverage is also known for paying our publishers reliably. This has always been the case, EVEN WHEN WE HAVE NOT BEEN PAID, from advertisers from time to time. While many of our publishers do not know it, over the years Market Leverage has paid significant commissions to publishers without receiving any payment from advertisers. The ONLY instance where payment to a publisher has not been made by us is when overtly fraudulent traffic is suspected. Obviously, we cannot just facilitate and be a party to such traffic streams. Just as we have gone out of our way to pay publishers to protect them from bad advertisers, we have to protect advertisers from fraudulent traffic.

Well, you don't protect me from a bad advertiser, and as far as you updated me - the advertiser hasn't even answered and I don't know how many efforts you put to talk with this advertiser. I would like to say it again - we did receive in the past complaints on fraud in our traffic which is reasonable for incentivized traffic however we've never received a complaint on all the traffic, like just coming and say 100% of my traffic is bad - it's more than ridiculous! Also, there are a lot of my users who complained on this advertiser too, claiming they don't have a proper customer service, and I wouldn't be surprised if this advertiser is a cooky one.

As much as I would like to, I cannot answer in detail the claims made by Arie. There are legal issues related to the traffic, which we are working to resolve. I will say, however, that with the exception of a couple of days, when I was in the middle of many things (as always :\ never time for me), Arie has been updated with the simple fact that I have had 'no news' to pass on. Furthermore, to date, this issue appears to be related to bad traffic, NOT LOW QUALITY traffic. Yes of course it's a bad traffic, you believe the advertiser and no other advertiser ever done such thing to me. We understand the difference, and have always insisted that advertisers recognize it too.
Right now I'm not even interested in payment, I want to talk to this advertiser and see what exactly he's relying on - and if you insist that advertiser recognize it too - do something about it - I'm waiting more than 1 month with this issue - how long it takes to get a freaking reply? And so far my account is the one which if off, and I'm glad now that Sal took it off too but I wonder how such a crook gets into this business? I definitely agree with this Sal that I might have fraud but I cannot agree 100% of the traffic is bad as I'm talking personally to some of the users who took this offer.
As always, if anyone has any questions about anything pertaining to Market Leverage, please feel free to call me directly at 407 805-8884 or AIM me at salvatoreatppm. THANKS!

[arie1985]

I just want to add that Sal explained me a bit about the story - I'm sad and a bit upset it took so so long to explain me this, but at least now I see the picture and it seems like a complicated story not only about my leads - well, thanks Sal for explaining this, I hope you could resolve it, as I really don't know what else to say, didn't know it went into such a complicated thing but in my opinion it's a good thing it's like that now

I just want to keep you all posted, it indeed took a lot of time, but as for this advertiser I don't expect it to answer properly to people as this advertiser does the same thing to a few of my users (and if I could talk to all of them I'm sure a lot of them would complain the same)

Sal, please keep everyone's posted on your findings - thanks for taking this matter into a "complicated story", it's a good thing and I'm sure it can only help now to set the truth to the air, that's the only way to deal with such problems in my opinion